Author Topic: Kinda cool.  (Read 7473 times)

Hipshot

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Kinda cool.
« on: December 25, 2013, 02:23:24 PM »




NekoBaron

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2013, 12:37:29 PM »
Ok, I'll make a guess. You added a way to create random rooms simply / can spawn like a tiny section of map.

Or there's like 300 overlapping object spawn on each one :p.

bewt

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2013, 05:39:51 AM »
Spawning Prefabs?

Hipshot

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2014, 01:08:54 PM »
Yea, spawn prefabs, using that system you could make random levels, even if it's a bit annoying to set up.
I might use it to make some things "more" random than I could have done before in the desert level.

bewt

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2014, 08:47:37 AM »
How does one go about making a prefab?

Hipshot

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2014, 12:08:54 PM »
It's a bit annoying at the moment, but you just save a level and then open it with notepad and surround it with <prefab> </prefab>
Then when you restart the editor, it will show up under the prefab tab.

But this current thing can't be done by "you" yet, spawn object can't spawn prefabs in 1.2, only in our later version.

Hipshot

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2014, 11:00:01 PM »
So I place the block in the editor, then when the level loads, it randoms between 3 different layouts of that chunk, there can be how many random variations as I feel I like to create.


Keppler

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2014, 02:13:33 PM »
That sounds great!
Don't be dismayed by people claiming that the content runs out quickly because the campaign never changes. There are some people (including me), who like that design better than cheaply created random dungeons. I think that the campaign map is very well thought out and I have no problem playing it over time and time again. Reminds me of the older games when there was no random map generation and people did not complain back then! :p


Edit: I edited this by mistake, but I reverted it, sorry. With so much power, it's easy to do mistakes =) /hipshot
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 04:17:23 PM by Hipshot »

Heretic

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2014, 04:19:47 PM »
With the example Hipshot provided that looks awesome as it can add some bonus or secret areas in your maps!

Hipshot

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2014, 04:17:53 PM »
That sounds great!
Don't be dismayed by people claiming that the content runs out quickly because the campaign never changes. There are some people (including me), who like that design better than cheaply created random dungeons. I think that the campaign map is very well thought out and I have no problem playing it over time and time again. Reminds me of the older games when there was no random map generation and people did not complain back then! :p
I don't really care much for all these dungeon crawlers that has completely randomized dungeons with no objectives, no interesting points etc, being a level designer I really like to design areas, make chooke points, locations of interest etc and It's always fun to hear that people like your work.

One of the charms of having a static level design is that you after a while learn it and can kinda optimize your play and go for time and score instead, it's really nice when you play with a few people that are really good and everyone know what to do and where to go.

The smaller random elements just adds to the experince, this however could allow somone to make a level that is really random, if they want. The prefab system has several limitations though, like they can't contain lamps, tilemaps and a few other things, but you can spawn enemies in them and do other things.

Heretic

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2014, 04:25:12 PM »
As an area designer myself I understand where you're coming from Hipshot! Procedural generation is the death of area-design.

HOWEVER

Roguelikes are a different type of game for a different type of skill anyways. Meant to be perma-death, randomized as hell, and very challenging. It's supposed to be a more arcady-style of playing where you play and play again, and play again until your skills have grown - at THAT game. Making the best decisions based on the randomized situation you're in, etc.

HW Is just a different game - the area design is a part of the challenge and game just like the randomized ones are. This is a set playing field, how good can you get at it?

I only defend the roguelikes because I <3 roguelikes a-lot :D But as an area designer, there is tragedy in the loss of that human touch and thought in the layout of the battlefield.

Enjay

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2014, 05:45:57 PM »
Well, I feel a noteworthy distinction is that regardless of the level of randomization, roguelikes and dungeon-crawlers are still different games. For example, Diablo is a highly randomized dungeon crawler, but that doesn't make it a rogue-like. So even as a fan of RL's, I feel fine agreeing with Hipshot in saying that when it comes to crawls, the fully scripted maps are almost always better. I would argue, though, that it would be a worthwhile challenge to see if you could maintain high-grade level design, while randomizing enough that the end product is not noticeably repetitive.

Would be a fun thing to try.
Every time I post I get nervous because I feel like the devs are judging me.

Mumpitz

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2014, 09:27:54 PM »
Why are tilemaps and s.o. not included in prefabs? Does it cause any problems?
I cant see the reason why they should not be included.
Is it cause tilemaps could mess up with ones already set?
greetings

Mumpitz

Hipshot

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2014, 10:30:01 PM »
Tilemaps doesn't work inside a prefab.
This entire thing can be tested with the 1.21 beta, or wait untill it's not beta any more.

Mumpitz

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Re: Kinda cool.
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2014, 01:27:44 AM »
I tried a bit with the beta 1.21 r1 build. Unfortunately the debug-build wasnt working, so i had to pack a campaign for every testing purpose and load it with the normal build. Felt like compiling the source. ;D

Spawning prefabs work well, but i discovered that prefabs cant include prefabs, but they can spawn them via script. Removing them with DestroyObject -> Last spawned also does not work. But this is logical i would say. The objects of a prefab are just included at this moment and work as single objects from this moment on. The game cant recognize which objects belong to the prefab anymore, right?
There is also a bug i think, spawned prefabs dont enlarge the explorable area on the minimap. It keeps being grey if you walk further away from the initial placed level elements.

I attached my testing campaign where i played a bit with many different editor things.

If you could make tilemaps and prefabs work inside prefabs, it would be awesome. Then i could build generated maps like in diablo. :)
And i could use my opaque walls inside prefabs. That would save me a lot of work in the future.
greetings

Mumpitz